Episode 35: Taking Control Of Your Life Through Entrepreneurship and Franchising W/ Wes Barefoot
January 24, 2024
Welcome to the 35th episode of the Self-Employment Success Podcast. My guest on today’s podcast is Wes Barefoot. Wes is the founder of Path to Freedom, a business that helps people find freedom and take control of their...
Welcome to the 35th episode of the Self-Employment Success Podcast. My guest on today’s podcast is Wes Barefoot. Wes is the founder of Path to Freedom, a business that helps people find freedom and take control of their lives through business ownership, specifically franchise ownership. Wes walks people through a tailored process to help them figure out what they truly want out of their life and career, and then matches them and walks with them through finding the right business that would allow them to experience that. In today’s episode we talk about franchise and business ownership. We discuss the pros and cons of franchising, from the ability to achieve success quicker because there is a tailored process and pre-built resources for a franchisee to use, to the fact that not all franchises are created or operate equally and can have more or less freedom based on the model. With that being said we explore the fact that there really is an option for every type of entrepreneur. Wes is passionate about helping people foster the life they long for through business ownership and that is evident all throughout this conversation. So with that introduction, I hope you enjoy today’s episode of the Self-Employment Success Podcast with Wes Barefoot.
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TRANSCRIPT
Leland Gross (00:01.786)
All right, welcome Wes Barefoot to the Self-Employment Success Podcast.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (00:05.718)
Hey Leland, thanks for having me man. I've been looking forward to this.
Leland Gross (00:08.846)
Yeah, I'm excited for today's conversation as well. Let's just jump right on in. Tell the listeners who you are, what you do, kind of where your business stands today.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (00:21.374)
Yeah, I'm happy to so I'm the founder and president of path to freedom, which is a franchise consulting firm. And so as a franchise consultant, I specialize in franchise ownership, my wife and I own franchise businesses ourselves as franchisees recently sold one of our franchise businesses. I've worked on the franchise or side as well. I've worked for numerous franchise brands earlier in my career.
So I've kind of sat on both sides of the table, which now puts me in a good position to really help educate others that are interested in learning about franchise ownership and what it entails and, and to take it even a step further to, to help them really take a more methodical approach to identifying the type of franchise business that makes sense for them to own.
narrowing it down to a more manageable list of specific franchises that they really want to look into and research in detail. And so I'm really there as a as a coach or a guide to help them navigate this entire process figuring out, you know, could owning a franchise makes sense for me? And if so, what's the right type of franchise? What are specific brands that meet the criteria that we've identified the right type of
business would look like for you. And, and then really guiding through all the due diligence that's necessary, you know, for anyone to get to the point of being ready to actually invest in a franchise business. And, um, so it's a, it's a very overwhelming process for the vast majority of people. And my role is really just to give them a more methodical approach to it. Um, and I work with a lot of different franchise companies. So.
On the one hand, I'm working with individuals, you know, through the process, I kind of just outline on the other hand, I'm, you know, always connecting with learning about a wide variety of franchise businesses. Right now I work with about 250 or so different franchise brands across a wide variety of industries, wide range of, you know, capital requirements. And I spent a lot of time vetting.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (02:41.494)
the brands that I work with to make sure they meet the criteria that I'm looking for to feel confident recommending a franchise to someone.
Leland Gross (02:53.074)
So I'm excited to dive into this topic because franchising is a wonderful path into self-employment. Some people don't want to go, hey, I'm going to put all of my money in and just bootstrap it myself, whatever business, and build it up. It's too much risk. So sometimes coming into a franchise where, hey, we have an outline. We have other people who've done this. We've got a...
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (03:11.553)
Yeah.
Leland Gross (03:20.07)
bigger like mothership business that's going to kind of give us all the resources can really be a quick path to success for a lot of people. Obviously, it's still hard work. So your job is, hey, for someone who is has that entrepreneurial itch, who has the drive for self-employment, but may not know exactly what they want, they haven't invented a new widget, they don't have the specific vision, they have the vision for entrepreneurship, you say, all right.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (03:43.916)
Exactly.
Leland Gross (03:49.978)
Let's figure out what you want. Let's figure out who you are, kind of what your resources are, what your desire is for this vision. And then you kind of help match them with, well, these businesses you can buy into and be an owner of the franchise and kind of take off from there. Is that high level? Correct.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (04:11.658)
Yeah, spot on. Yeah, 100%. I mean, an easy comparison is, you know, to a real estate agent, right? If you were looking for a house and if you had a good, you know, real estate agent that was going to help you find the right house for you, you're probably going to spend some time on the front end with that real estate agent talking about, you know, what's important to you in a house, right? Do you want something with a great backyard because you like to entertain and you know, you and the family like to spend a lot of time outside. How many kids do you have? How many bedrooms do you need?
Leland Gross (04:31.059)
Mmm.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (04:39.83)
you know, what do you want the kitchen and entertainment area to look like there's all these criteria that you know, some of which is going to be very important to you, but may not be as important to the next person. And so a good real estate agent is going to get clear on what it is you're really looking to get out of the right home for you. And then they're going to go off and leverage relationships, their knowledge of the market, you know, all of their expertise and then bring you back.
Leland Gross (04:59.167)
Mmm.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (05:07.882)
a short list of options that really meet the criteria that you've identified with them. So very, very similar to what I'm doing just with franchise businesses.
Leland Gross (05:18.894)
In that model of serving someone is ultimately what everybody wants. Like people don't want you to be like, a real estate agent isn't like pushing this house. Here's the house you want. Here's the house you want. They're taking the time to really understand you and your desires and your family. And that's similar to what I do of, Hey, there's a million financial products out there you can invest in, but what's the actual life you want? What are we trying to build? And what's the, that way I can come and say, this is the clearest path.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (05:27.53)
Yeah, they shouldn't be.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (05:43.743)
Yes.
Leland Gross (05:48.99)
to your goal and that's what you're doing, it sounds like, with franchise businesses. What is the vision?
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (05:56.442)
Exactly. And it's and it's my favorite thing about, you know, this type of work, because earlier in my career, you know, I worked for a couple of different franchisers. So that's kind of the national corporate level of a franchise. And a lot of what I did for the brands that I worked for was franchise sales and development. So I was responsible for essentially selling new franchises recruiting in new franchisees and
You know, to do that right in any franchise, you still shouldn't really be selling, you know, in the way a lot of people think of selling like, you know, high pressure sales tactics. It shouldn't be that because, you know, the franchising model works when it's done right because it's a partnership between the franchisee and the franchisor and it's mutually beneficial. And so smart franchisors realize they don't want just anyone as a franchisee, anyone that's willing
Leland Gross (06:35.431)
Mm-hmm.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (06:52.886)
you know, pay them a fee and sign an agreement. They want people that, you know, really understand what the business is, what it's going to take to be successful. And they have a realistic understanding of the challenges that the business is going to have, because any of these businesses will have challenges and there's no guarantee of success. And so anyways, the, the sales process should not be, you know, this hardcore sales process, but at the same time,
It was my job to sell, right? And I had goals and quotas and, you know, at the end of the day, if someone wasn't a right fit for the brand that I was representing, that was kind of the end of the road in terms of my ability to help them out. And so now as a consultant where I don't work directly for any one brand, I've got a wide variety of really high quality franchise businesses that I work with. I can really dig in.
Leland Gross (07:25.244)
Yeah.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (07:52.382)
and get to know the people that I'm working with. And, you know, there's so much that has to fall in line, you know, for it to make sense for someone to make the transition into business ownership. It's a big life change, right? So there's a lot of stars that have to align, if you will. And so it's not uncommon for me to, you know, work with someone for a year, two years, three years, even if it's off and on.
Leland Gross (08:05.275)
Mmm.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (08:22.334)
you know, until the timing is, is ideal. And until we find the right opportunity for them. And on top of that, I'm not I'm not selling anything, which is something that I really enjoy about it. I'm more of a guide or a coach, and I'm kind of connecting dots. And that's, I think what I enjoy most out of what I'm doing. Plus, you know, I nerd out on this stuff. I love spending, you know, a good chunk of my time just researching different
Leland Gross (08:41.381)
Hmm
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (08:51.618)
franchises and different business models and really kind of getting in the weeds. It's, it's a, a fun, fun business for, for me to be a part of. I really enjoy it.
Leland Gross (09:02.566)
Well, and I really respect that transition. As you know, I was in a similar boat where I was in a financial advisor space that was like, I'm representing this company. So I'm selling their products. My job is to go get new clients into these investments. And it was just so transactional. So making the transition to, hey, I can help you get into any investment product, but I'm representing you, the client, is so much of a healthier.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (09:12.524)
Yeah.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (09:30.188)
Yep.
Leland Gross (09:32.742)
position to be because it's all like at the end of the day, business is sales. Like I'm selling myself and my services more than I'm selling some other company's products. But again, it's from a truly like authentic relational perspective, which is what you're doing as well as like, hey, we're not on a time crunch here. We're here to help you build your dreams and I can help you do that. And so it can be a real win-win.
Nobody gets into entrepreneurship because they love working late nights, weekends, holidays, figuring out how to pay their own taxes. Like that's not why we do it. We get into it because we have a vision of freedom, of supporting our family better than we can as a W-2 employee. And that's kind of what you're doing is saying, all right, you have this vision. What is that? And now let's put the pieces together, which is so much more fulfilling.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (10:10.175)
No, not at all.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (10:28.694)
Yeah, exactly. And we spend a, we spend a lot of time, you know, upfront really talking about and getting clear on what that vision is because, you know, the, the business itself is really nothing more than a vehicle, right? A vehicle to help you get where it is you want to go. And, you know, one of the biggest things I've learned, uh, in doing this and, you know, I, I
Leland Gross (10:46.566)
Mm-hmm.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (10:56.098)
obviously was somewhat intentional in my branding, calling the business path to freedom because that is a very core theme of what most people are looking for more of when they decide to explore business ownership, they want more freedom. But I've also learned that freedom means different things to different people and can look different. You know, there's usually some common themes that most people are.
Leland Gross (11:13.702)
Mmm.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (11:24.222)
looking for when they say they want more freedom. But if you drill down deeper, that can look very different from one person to the next. And so you've got all these different, you know, business models out there. Contrary to what a lot of people think, there's a lot more to franchising than just, you know, burger joints and sub shops. You know, the types of franchises my wife and I own and have owned are in the home service home improvement categories, right? I work with a lot of brands that are in
you know, fitness, health, wellness, senior care, childhood enrichment, automotive services, B2B services, I mean, the lists go on and on. And so the point of that is there's all these different business models. And with different business models come different roles and responsibilities for the franchise owner. And so before I start talking about industries, or certainly before I start talking about specific franchises with anyone,
we really spend some time talking about, all right, you know, where are you today? And what do you want your life to look like a year from now, five years from now, 10 years from now? And what is it about where you are right now that, that makes you think you're not in a position to accomplish some of these goals that you have. And if I have a really good understanding of that, then that's going to put me in a great position to actually come back and recommend the right types.
Leland Gross (12:41.01)
You know what I mean.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (12:50.698)
of businesses to help someone actually build the type of life that they won't. Because I'm sure you've seen this with many of your clients over the years. Unfortunately, a lot of times people get into business ownership because they want more freedom. They want more control of their time. You know, usually increased earning potential is a part of it as well. But if people don't get into the right type of business, a lot of times they find out they have less time.
maybe even less control of their time, less freedom, even if the earning potential is more, and the financial resources are more, a lot of times that's not worth it, if you're working 80 hour weeks and you know, stress to the max all the time. And so, you know, there's numerous things that can cause that. But a lot of times, it's simply getting into the wrong type of business, right. And so, you know, if you're looking for something with really good quality of life, say, you've got young kids, and you want to be able to
Leland Gross (13:22.851)
Mm-hmm.
Leland Gross (13:33.822)
Totally.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (13:49.462)
You know, be at baseball practice and games in the evenings and things on the weekends, like, you know, maybe a restaurant's not the best business for you because of what would be required of you as the owner day in day out to really get the right results from the business. That's probably not the best model for you, but there are going to be other business models out there where the role and responsibility of the owner is going to be much better suited to the type of lifestyle.
Leland Gross (14:09.754)
Yeah.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (14:18.754)
that you're looking for. So that's where we start. And then we can really start identifying the right types of business models. And then from there, because look, most people are like, well, look, I want to I want to be in a business that, you know, I'm, I'm excited about the product or service that we're providing, or I at least believe, you know, in the product or service that we're providing and can see how we're adding value to our clients. That's perfect. You should want that. But, you know,
getting into a business just because you're passionate about the product or the service, or you would personally be a customer of the business is not usually the best leading indicator in terms of, you know, how to select the right business to get into.
Leland Gross (15:03.954)
Totally, because so often you're gonna get in so passionate about the product or the service, but having no idea of the quality of life that it's gonna bring you to actually be involved. There's one thing to be like a fan of it and another thing to be in charge of it. And I do think that's the beautiful thing about franchise ownership is like, many of the bootstrappers, like the entrepreneur, I'm gonna build this from the ground up, are the people who have, who go into it.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (15:14.562)
Yeah.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (15:21.058)
Totally.
Leland Gross (15:34.438)
with the initial passion for the product or service. And then they have to kind of learn the business side of it. Whereas with franchise ownership, those people are coming in with a love and desire for entrepreneurship. And then it's kind of matching the product and service that can kind of fill that. So you're almost coming at it from a different angle on the front end, starting with the quality of life.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (15:38.039)
Yeah.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (15:48.428)
Yeah.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (15:56.566)
You are, which is a really, it's a really good point. Cause one of the biggest misconceptions I run into, you know, as I'm talking with people and we work through my process, you know, I may come back and recommend a brand that's in an industry that you have zero experience in, right? And so naturally you might think, well, Wes, I don't, I'll give you an example. Like the, the first franchise, my wife and I got into, we still own this business today, we've been, we're in our sixth year of business.
It's a franchise called shelf genie. And so we sell and install custom pullout shelving solutions and custom closet solution. So it's all about home organization and making things more accessible and maximizing storage and all of that. Right? I'm not a handy guy. Right? I have zero business building shelves, installing shelves, like you don't even want me to hang a picture on your wall in your house. Okay.
Same deal with my wife. She was in pharmaceutical cells before we got into this franchise. And she's really the one that, that has run in the day to day of that business and built it into a very successful business for us. Um, so, you know, you would likely think what, what do we know about getting into this type of franchise? And so to your point earlier, because
The system for the business is already there. The playbook for the business is already there. The franchisor is not really looking for franchise owners that want to be on the front line of the business swinging the hammer, if you will. They're looking for franchise owners that have some business savvy and have the desire to build a business that's bigger than just themselves, right? Because if...
using the example of shelf genie, if they just went out and said, Hey, let's, you know, let's go market this to, you know, contractors or carpenters or something to bring them in as franchise owners, they'd end up with a lot of people that essentially bought themselves a job. And the business wouldn't scale in all likelihood, right, the business wouldn't scale to the point that it could where if you have a business minded owner that may not have the skill set to go out and
Leland Gross (18:04.767)
Mmm.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (18:12.654)
provide the service directly to the consumer on the front lines, but has some experience or at least some willingness to build a team and invest in that team, right? Bring in people around them that are better qualified for whatever the roles the business requires so that the owner can spend the vast majority of their time, you know, looking at the big picture. I talk a lot with people about the difference between working in your business and working on your business.
Leland Gross (18:41.585)
Mm-hmm
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (18:42.278)
Almost every franchise or out there wants the franchisee that has the desire and the ability to work on the business instead of in the business because that's going to allow them to scale, which is what the franchise or wants because if you really drill down and look at the franchise or his business model, you know, they don't really make their money on the initial fees that they get from selling franchises, they make their money through the royalties, which
Leland Gross (18:53.71)
Mm-hmm.
Leland Gross (19:10.051)
Mm-hmm.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (19:10.25)
royalties are, you know, usually a small percentage of each franchisee's gross revenue. So the more revenue a franchisee is doing, the better that is for the franchise or but where this is, you know, a little bit counterintuitive, but that mutual alignment really falls into place between franchisee and franchise or is that once you get to a point in your business where most if not all of your time is spent working on the business instead of in it, that's when you really start
benefiting from what most people are looking for in business ownership, more control of your time, more freedom of your schedule, right, better financial resources, like one of the craziest things to my wife and I, as we've built our businesses and started to, you know, really have some success and get to that place where we work more on the business than in it, is almost feeling guilty a little bit sometimes where it's like
man, we're working less and less in terms of like hours, right? But the business is growing. The financial rewards are growing. Uh, we're getting more of that control of our time and schedule. And so that was something that we had to wrestle with a little bit at times where it's like, man, we almost feel bad because we're not out there grinding, putting in 40, 50 hour weeks. Like we were in the very beginning as we started building these.
Leland Gross (20:10.586)
Mm-hmm
Leland Gross (20:32.626)
Mmm.
Isn't that funny, the like guilt of working less when like that's the dream to begin with. Like the psychology of self-employment is a funny thing where you're like I'm finally seeing the reward I've wanted but now I'm like oh I feel bad that I'm like not working as much.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (20:41.662)
Yeah.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (20:45.745)
It really is.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (20:51.946)
Yeah, well, it really is. And look, if you're doing it right, you know, you really shouldn't feel bad in my opinion, right? I mean, it's one thing if you're like taking advantage of your employees and working them like dogs and not taking very good care of them. But you know, chances are any, any control of your schedule that you're going to have, if you're using that approach is going to be pretty short lived because you're probably turning people over very regularly, right? Whereas in our businesses, one of the things we
Leland Gross (21:04.474)
Of course, yeah.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (21:21.462)
you know, have enjoyed most about business ownership has been giving other people opportunities to work hard, but earn great money. And so like, you know, in, in the shelf genie business that I've, I've referenced as an example, most of our team has been with us since the first year of the business, you know, we've got a great team. Some of them can make really good money. The not to get too into the weeds of like how that
that business is set up, but most of them are technically 1099 contractors. And so some of them, like our installers, the guys that install the products, we've got a guy that's a firefighter, we've got a guy that's a state trooper, you know, they kind of look at shelf genie as their side business when they're not at their career job, right. And they've got a lot of time on a monthly basis that they're not at the station. We've been able to pay these guys more.
Leland Gross (22:10.907)
You're doing this.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (22:20.75)
through our company than they make as a firefighter or a state trooper, you know, and that's a really good feeling for us. But it's also what has allowed us to, you know, really get the benefit that we wanted out of business ownership is give good people good opportunities, give them the training, the support and the resources that they need to really do well in their job. And as long as you're willing to pay them well for
Leland Gross (22:24.818)
Hmm.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (22:48.93)
for the results that they're generating for you, they're gonna be happy to go out and bust their tail for you. And so, that's been the most enjoyable thing, but also, like I said, a little bit counterintuitive and something that we've had to kind of step back and process that, hey, we shouldn't feel guilty that we're really reaping some of the rewards that we set out to get in starting our own businesses.
Leland Gross (22:55.695)
Mmm.
Leland Gross (23:17.358)
Yeah. So Wes, how did you get into franchising? Like you're clearly such an expert. Like you have worked for franchisors, you're a franchise consultant, you are a franchise or like you're a franchisee, you own a franchise. And so but what how did you find your way into this space?
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (23:31.819)
Yeah.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (23:39.502)
Well, I'd love to sit here and tell you it was all part of this master plan and that it was calculated, but you know, I went to business school, you know, undergrad, I don't think I ever heard the term franchise mentioned, you know, in three years of business school or whatever it was, it wasn't something that, you know, you really got taught about or learned about. And, you know, so out of college, if I heard the term franchising, I would have
just like a lot of people thought, oh, McDonald's subway, you know, maybe even hotels, but you know, in my mind, it was pretty much food businesses, right? And it wasn't something that was on my radar. And, you know, so I got out of school, and I, you know, wanted the corporate career and wanted to kind of climb the corporate ladder. And we're probably pretty close in age, Leland, I got out of college in 09. So not exactly an ideal
job market at the time, the economy was really kind of in the tank. And there just weren't a lot of companies out there looking to hire a kid right out of school with no real work experience. One of the few companies that was Enterprise Rent-A-Car and they have what they call their management training program. And so I was able to plug in with them and work there for about three years and you know, worked my way up to a branch manager level. And, you know, that was great for a couple of reasons.
One, I just learned a ton doing it. You also work your tell off for not a ton of income, comparatively speaking, but as you work your way up, they really put you in a position where you're kind of running your own business, right? As an assistant branch manager, as a branch manager, you have a lot of autonomy, you're responsible for your branch, the employees that work there, the profitability.
Leland Gross (25:24.734)
Thank you.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (25:33.57)
you know, you're largely compensated off of the profitability of your branch that you run. And so, you know, that was great in terms of just starting to really understand profit and loss and, you know, how as an owner or someone responsible for, you know, a business, you can positively or negatively impact the profitability. And so at the time, I didn't know that, you know, that would be so instrumental in helping us build our own businesses one day.
Leland Gross (25:56.645)
Hmm.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (26:03.89)
But the other really valuable thing that came out of that, and I didn't know this at the time, but looking back on it, I can pretty clearly see that it pretty quickly taught me that I did not want to spend 10, 15, 20 years of my career in kind of the corporate rat race and trying to climb that corporate ladder. Because what I saw at Enterprise, and they're structured similarly to most companies.
Leland Gross (26:23.334)
Mmm.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (26:32.05)
one thing's different, they only promote from within, right? So you would think if you start more opportunity to move up, right? Because you're not having to compete with people from outside of the company that may be interviewing for positions higher up. But like most big companies, it really starts to bottleneck the higher up you get in the company. And so, you know, I had managers, area managers and such that had been with the company for 15, 20 years. These were guys that
I learned a ton from and had a lot of respect for, and they'd been in the same role for like 10 years, you know, and they weren't going anywhere unless someone above them died, got fired, or if they were willing to pick their families up and move them to wherever in the country, a position opened up that they were able to interview for probably against hundreds of other people throwing for the same position and get offered the job. And so-
That was a really valuable lesson for me. And, you know, this all happened in Louisiana. I'm in North Carolina now born and raised, chased a girl down to Louisiana after college. Fortunately, she's my wife now. So that part of it worked out. It worked out. Yeah. Yeah, that's a long way to go and come back empty handed. But she, I don't know if she would say it worked out, but it worked out for me. I definitely, definitely married up.
Leland Gross (27:46.371)
that worked out.
Leland Gross (27:57.235)
Thank you.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (28:00.078)
and I'm playing above my pay grade there. But anyways, we come back to North Carolina after she gets done with college and I was able to transfer with enterprise but I started taking I had to take a step back two steps back to do so. Anyways, long story short, I just kind of started looking to see what else was out there and I met these guys in Wilmington, North Carolina where we live now that had started a company a few years prior and they'd recently started franchising.
Leland Gross (28:00.855)
Mm.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (28:29.782)
the business. And so they were young, they were small, they were in growth mode, they were looking to staff up. I like the founders, I didn't know anything about franchising or the industry that they were in, which was like medical device and accessibility equipment. But it, it felt fast, it felt like a startup, it just felt interesting, right?
Leland Gross (28:54.102)
Mm.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (28:54.326)
So that's how I kind of fell backwards into franchising and, and you know, one thing led to another, I was able to, you know, really kind of grow with that company. And that's where I first got into franchise sells and helped, you know, take them to a national brand and even into Canada. And then that, that opened up doors to go work for another franchise or, which was actually Shelf Genie. And then that's, that's how we ended up buying our first franchise. So definitely a roundabout way.
of doing it, you know, one of those things I think about pretty often where I'm like, man, what if one thing would have gone different? You know, there's, there's no way, you know, I would have found franchising and, you know, all the doors that have opened since then would have, would have opened.
Leland Gross (29:36.419)
Mm.
Leland Gross (29:41.222)
Well, maybe listening to this podcast is that moment for someone else. Like if I had never listened to that podcast, I would have never. Um, so how did you get into franchise consulting? Like when did you create path to freedom? It makes sense kind of how you wound your way into owning franchises, but that next step of, Hey, now I want to help other people do this.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (29:44.407)
Yeah.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (29:48.14)
Yeah.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (30:04.63)
Yeah. Um, so started the company about four years ago and you know, it wasn't like I had this revolutionary idea that, Oh, I should, you know, kind of be a consultant where I'm not selling franchises or working directly for franchises, but I'm just kind of helping people navigate the process. There's other franchise consultants out there. There's people that have been doing this for, you know, 25, 30 years at this point. Um, when I worked for.
the different brands that I worked for and was responsible for selling the franchises. That's how we got a lot of our franchisees was from working with these franchise consultants. So when I had those roles, a big part of my job was getting out and meeting and networking with franchise consultants and really educating them on our business and the type of franchise owners we were looking for.
you know, who tended to do well as an owner with our brand, because that's where a lot of our leads or referrals would come from. And so, you know, I got an understanding of how that franchise consulting world worked through all of that. And I mean, I can remember going back to the first brand I worked for the very first, I mean, I was probably a month or two in at this time and in franchising, the franchise or
Leland Gross (31:16.488)
Hmm
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (31:29.026)
host what they call a discovery day, right? So if someone's been researching the franchise and is considering becoming a franchisee, one of the final kind of formal due diligence steps you would go through is you would go to a discovery day, which is usually at the franchisor's headquarters. And it's really a chance for you as a prospective franchisee and the leadership team of the franchisor to sit down and meet.
face to face and really just spend some time getting to know each other and make sure everyone feels good about a partnership. Right. So remember the first discovery day I was at for this first brand and you know had a few groups of people coming in that were considering becoming franchisees and one of them had a franchise consultant come with them. And I just remember one of the founders explaining to me who that person was.
what their role and kind of the grand scheme of things was. And I can remember thinking at that point in time, like, man, that's something I would really enjoy doing myself at some point. And never really thought that it would become a reality or what happened as quickly as it was able to. But that's how I got into it. And the drive there was kind of what I said earlier. I loved working for the brands that I worked for earlier, but earlier in my career. But...
You just kind of limited, right? You have one, one offering pretty much. And so, you know, I met a lot of great people when I represented those brands. And, you know, it just became clear for one reason or another that they weren't the right fit for our franchise or vice versa. And, and I just wasn't in a position to help them any longer. And, um, that was part of it. The other part of it was we started having kids and having a family and, you know, I traveled a ton. So, you know, I wanted more flexibility and more control. And.
Leland Gross (32:51.456)
Okay.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (33:18.966)
You know, this, I started path to freedom after we started our first franchise business. And so it was really because of our first franchise that I was able to, you know, pretty comfortably walk away from pretty good gig with a, you know, nice base salary, plenty of commission opportunity, good benefits, you know, because we had been building our shelf genie franchise for a year, year and a half by the time I did that. And so we had good income from the business that
you know, made it a lot less intimidating to walk away from the W2 job and income. So a lot of it was driven by what we've talked about today, just wanted more control of my time and schedule. And, you know, that's been, that's been great. We've got three young kids now and, you know, I'm kind of able to do as much or as little of the consulting work as I want to.
Leland Gross (34:04.228)
Okay.
Leland Gross (34:15.134)
That's awesome. So franchising has tons and tons of pros to it from a, if I'm the entrepreneur, I wanna get into a business. There's so much opportunity for how much you're in it, what it requires of you, what it costs upfront, the freedom. What would be some of the cons or things that, you know, if we're playing devil's advocate on franchises.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (34:42.05)
Yeah, it's absolutely worth talking about because it's not a perfect model and it's not going to be for everyone. And the first kind of con I'll mention, I'll tie it back into, you know, what you said about franchising, having a lot of pros. You know, one of the cons is that not all franchises are created equally, right? And so there are plenty of franchise businesses out there that there's really no pros to it at all.
Leland Gross (35:03.099)
..Mmm.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (35:10.462)
If you really dig in and know what you're looking for and understand what the franchise is providing. And so one of the things I talk a lot about on my podcasts and to people that, that I'm working with is that, you know, franchising when it's done right. Right. Like I use that phrase all the time because it's like anything else in this world, there's great franchises, there's terrible franchises and there's everything in between, right? There's new young emerging franchises that.
Leland Gross (35:37.36)
Mm-hmm.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (35:40.542)
will be great one day, but they're not there yet. They're still learning and figuring it out. And so that's important to understand and to always keep in mind. In general though, even taking into consideration great franchises, some of the cons that people may look at or view as cons, one there's...
there's parameters, right? You do enter into a franchise agreement with the franchisor, right? And those agreements are going to have guard rails in terms of what you can and can't do as a franchise owner, right? So, a lot of people listening have probably seen the movie, The Founder, at one point with, it was Michael Keaton.
Leland Gross (36:28.235)
Mm-hmm.
Leland Gross (36:31.953)
Yep.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (36:32.398)
Uh, anyways, Ray cries about Ray crocker and building McDonald's. And you know, there's, there's a point in the movie where they're first starting to really get some franchisees and he gets really pissed off because he finds out that some of the franchisees are selling pizza and you know, like they've just totally changed the menu from what it was supposed to be. That's a, that's a really good example of where like in most franchises, you're going to be limited in how much you can innovate as a franchisee. And, and so.
for some people that are very, very entrepreneurial and kind of just want to, you know, they want to be over here doing this today, but then they have this idea over here that they want to chase and they're, you know, just, they want to be all over the place. A franchise is probably not going to feel very comfortable for them. In some ways, a franchise can, can be limited in its growth potential as well. Right. I mean, most franchises are territory based.
Leland Gross (37:17.748)
Mmm.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (37:29.386)
right and that can look different depending on if you have a franchise that's more of a brick and mortar storefront model versus something that's more service based where you're going out to your customers to provide a product or a service. But either way you have a territory that you are kind of limited in terms of where you can go and offer your products or services and you know you see this all the time where franchisees scale through
a single brand by adding more territory or adding more locations, but without doing that, you're going to be somewhat limited in your growth potential. So those are a few of the cons. Maybe not everyone would view that as cons, but certainly, you know, some especially very entrepreneurial people would, you know, one thing I'll add on to that and then and then we can move on, I guess, but
I don't want people to take away from that, you know, if you own a franchise, you don't get to be entrepreneurial at all. And you don't get to innovate at all. This is another thing I talk a lot about with people is as we're working with another good example where one type of franchise could be a great fit for one person, but not a great fit for the next person. Because you know, franchises, you've got brands like McDonald's, right? That globally known.
Leland Gross (38:33.898)
Mmm.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (38:53.478)
been around for a very long time, very well established, right? Not a whole lot of innovation going on at this point at the franchisee level with a brand like McDonald's, right? And that's great for some people. All right. Think about the person that's maybe an accountant or an engineer or someone, but you know, wants to own their own business, but probably doesn't want something where they've got a really
Leland Gross (39:03.806)
Thank you.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (39:16.498)
innovate and figure a lot of it out. They just want something that's going to be more plug and play. And I don't mean that to be a stereotype. But then there's going to be people that love the idea of business ownership love a lot of the things that a franchise brings to the table, but would be more excited and more happy to be in something where they can be a little more entrepreneurial and really kind of innovate, right? So something like a shelf genie, just because we've used that as an example.
where it's more service based, right? Still great systems, still a playbook, still a lot of good resources, but just because of the nature of the business where you don't have people coming to you, you're going out and developing a market, there's a lot more room for the franchise owners to get creative and to innovate and find new ways to get in front of customers, find new ways to network with referral partners and strategic partnerships.
Um, and then there's, you know, what I mentioned earlier, younger emerging brands, right, which sometimes can, can look a little bit riskier because they haven't been around as long. They don't have as much of a track record. Um, but if you can mitigate some of that risk, those can be great for someone that is more entrepreneurial because the franchise or is asking the franchisees as they're growing to help them innovate and help them really refine the business model. So.
Leland Gross (40:19.61)
Mm-hmm.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (40:43.278)
Um, just wanted to kind of point that out because I don't want people to think that, Oh, if you buy a franchise, you don't, you don't really do anything entrepreneurial that doesn't have to be the case at all.
Leland Gross (40:55.93)
Well, totally. And when it comes to entrepreneurship, there is such a spectrum of like total risk, total reward, total freedom to like still risk, still reward, but less of each of those because you know you're paying a mothership who like you have a royalty but then you get all these systems in place that kind of help you move closer towards success quicker and everything in between.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (40:59.416)
Thank you.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (41:05.151)
Yeah.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (41:17.207)
Mm-hmm.
Leland Gross (41:23.79)
you know, like everything is kind of on a spectrum of however you want it to be, which is the beautiful thing about franchising is you get a lot of that spectrum where you can kind of play in and figure out like with my personality, what makes the most sense.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (41:32.778)
Yeah, there's, there's almost something for everyone. Like, you know, when I work with someone that genuinely wants to get into business ownership, you know, has the financial means to do so, and is not just so entrepreneurial that any confines whatsoever is going to be uncomfortable for them. It is very, very rare that.
You know, I can't help them find at least one franchise that checks all of the boxes that they're looking for and, and makes a lot of sense for them and is doable and viable for them. So it almost something for everyone, which is, which is surprising, you know, to some because they just, you know, don't fully see the, the
landscape of all the different types of franchises that are out there. I mean, there's, there's franchises that blow people's mind. You know, I had a, I had a franchise or my podcast a few months ago, they do crime scene and biohazard cleanup. So you know, if that's something that you're into, there's a franchise out there for that. But a lot of a lot of options out there.
Leland Gross (42:56.126)
So for you in your journey from enterprise all the way until now, what surprised you the most about entrepreneurship or your journey of self-employment?
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (43:09.982)
Yeah, I think it's a good question. You know, I think the thing that surprised me the most and my wife as well, because we've talked about this. I mean, one of the things you know, we touched on earlier where, you know, there's almost been a little bit of guilt as we've started having some success and really getting out of owning businesses what we wanted in the first place. But, you know, beyond that, what my wife and I have learned is that
And this varies from one person to the next. So this is not, you know, going to apply to everyone necessarily, but what we've really become passionate about is not necessarily the widget that we provide in our businesses, but we've gotten passionate about building great teams in our businesses.
empowering those teams and putting them in a position to do well for themselves financially, which I kind of touched on earlier. But in addition to that, providing a service and a customer experience that exceeds our clients expectations. Right. And again, this won't apply to everyone, right? I realize there are people out there that are like, Wes, all that sounds great. But like, if I'm going to get into a business, I need to, like love or be passionate about
the product or the service. That's great. Just make sure you look at what we kind of touched on earlier, which is what do you want your lifestyle to look like and make sure the business model and your role and responsibilities as the owner is going to allow for that type of lifestyle if you execute well. But my wife and I have learned because I mean, I don't think this came up, but the other franchise that we owned and recently sold was an insulation business.
Leland Gross (44:52.207)
Mm-hmm.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (45:02.274)
Like I can tell you one thing, I've never been passionate about insulation in my life. I'm far less passionate about it today than I was the day we got into an insulation business, right? But it's a good business to be in for, for a lot of different reasons. All right. And one of the things we did well in that business was we provided a far superior customer experience to, to all of our customers, whether that was a home builder, a homeowner.
Leland Gross (45:11.07)
Thanks for watching!
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (45:30.614)
you know, a contractor or remodel or whatever the case is, when it comes to insulation, every insulation company is out there selling the same product. There's no way to differentiate yourself. You know, I've got superior insulation to you. It's all the same stuff for the most part, right? So that's been that's been surprising, I would say pleasantly, you know, surprising, you know, for us is that we've, we've gotten so much enjoyment out of
Leland Gross (45:46.334)
Hmm.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (45:56.622)
creating great opportunities for our teams and building great teams, which allows us to provide a, a superior customer experience, um, or at least a customer experience that exceeds the, the expectations of our clients. And now that opens us up to almost any. Type of business we could ever want to get to in the future, because we're not going to have to be so picky to say, all right, well, we need to really be passionate about the industry or the product of the service.
Leland Gross (46:24.024)
Hmm
And what was the low point for you?
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (46:30.274)
Oh, man. There's been there's been several but then I'm sure there will be more it's a roller coaster, right? But you know, we had when we started the installation franchise, we you know, at this point, I had my consulting firm, we had our other shelf genie franchise that's really my wife's kind of full time focus. So, you know, we did it with a business partner.
as well as an operating partner, right? Who was really going to manage and run the day to day in exchange for, um, phantom equity, which probably don't have time to get into what I mean by that. But basically he would get paid as though he had ownership and the, the better he managed the business, the more grew and the more, um, or at least as long as he maintained a certain profit margin, you know, he would get paid as though he had ownership in the company. And so that, that was the plan. Right. Because.
between my wife and I, neither of us had the bandwidth to go and run another business full time, especially build it from the ground up. And, you know, the goal was get it to where we've got, you know, a decent kind of additional income coming in each month and build it to the point over the course of three to five years where we could sell it and sell it for, you know, a nice multiple of our, our profits or our EBITDA.
Uh, first year, year and a half, you know, the plan was, was all falling in place. And then, you know, around the time we hit our second year, our operating partner, belled on us, no notice, no, no heads up, just belled. And now all of a sudden we've got this, you know, seven figure plus business with 12 employees and you know, customers and, you know, just a business that's moving pretty quick.
Leland Gross (48:11.226)
Mmm.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (48:23.67)
with no one to run the day to day. And so, you know, between my wife and I, you know, our business partner had some personal issues and things going on. So between my wife and I, we had to figure out how to jump in, run this business, keep the other balls that we were juggling in the air. And so anyways, that's the business that we just sold about a month ago at the time of recording this. So.
Leland Gross (48:51.163)
Hmm.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (48:51.534)
There were definitely some low points that came with that because, you know, we understood the business, we knew the business, but hadn't been involved in the day to day. And it's one thing to step into a brand new business and learn it. As you're building it. It's a totally another thing to step in, you know, when it's a pretty decent size and moving full speed already. Um, so there were, there were some frustrating.
down times that came with that, you know, we sold it, but we didn't sell it for the type of multiple that we had intended. You know, when we when we first set out to do it, so, you know, we came out a little ahead of even but it wasn't like a financial windfall for us. So definitely some humbling moments there. A lot of great learning lessons that, you know, we'll be able to take and apply going forward, but
Leland Gross (49:39.492)
Mm.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (49:48.215)
That whole experience was probably easily the biggest low point.
Leland Gross (49:53.518)
Yeah, sounds like it. So I ask everybody on the podcast this, and you alluded to it a little bit earlier when you said freedom means different things to different people. I find the same is true of success, probably for similar reasons. But this is a podcast about success. And when you ask anybody on the street, you're gonna get a different answer if you ask them, how do you define success? So for you, Wes, how would you define success? And how will you know?
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (50:15.638)
Yeah.
Leland Gross (50:23.49)
if or when you've achieved it.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (50:25.714)
Yeah. So, so for me, success is, um, being able to wake up every day and no one to answer to other than my responsibilities that are self-imposed, I guess, is how I would put it, right? So, and I can remember, you know, early in my career looking at a mentor of mine that, you know,
had multiple businesses and sold businesses. And I can remember, you know, telling my wife at one point, like, man, I, you see what Luke's doing, like, all he does is wake up every day and manage his shit. Like, that's kind of how I came to think of it was, you know, I don't want to have to answer to anyone in terms of an employer. Right. So that's part of it, right? Because that's to me, that's enjoyable, right? It doesn't feel like work, right? I mean, there are days, of course, where you're gonna
Leland Gross (51:06.194)
Hmm.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (51:22.146)
do things that you'd rather not be doing. But, you know, when it's yours, it's, it doesn't feel as much like work, right? It's just, it's building. So I like having every day be a little bit different, but, um, you know, my working time has been managing things that we own and are building. Um, with that, of course comes the, the financial component, right? So I'm not the guy that wants to drive a Ferrari or have a yacht. I just, I don't want to have to spend any.
Leland Gross (51:30.162)
Hmm.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (51:50.946)
time stressing about, am I able to take care of my family and give them the type of lifestyle that we want to be able to give them? Right? I don't, I don't want to have to look at price tags. Doesn't mean I want to live this crazy lavish, lavish life. But at the same time, we want to, we want to live comfortably, we want to be able to go the places we want to go do the places we want to go. And so, you know, I think part of the question was, how do you know if you're there yet?
Leland Gross (51:59.447)
No.
Okay.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (52:21.55)
Um, my hunch tells me it's one of those things that you probably never completely like wake up one day and you're like, all right, we're there. What do we do now? You know, I think at least the way most entrepreneurs are wired, there's always going to be some drive to kind of keep, you know, pushing things to the next level. But, you know, I would say we're close. Um, we're close in terms of, you know, we don't answer it. Anyone, you know, other than
Leland Gross (52:30.301)
Hmm.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (52:50.194)
each other in terms of my wife and I and, you know, in a way we answer to our customers and our employees because they're there are responsibility but you know, we spend our working time managing things that we own and that we're building and you know, I'm we live a great lifestyle. We're building a beautiful new house on the Intercoastal Waterway in Wilmington where we live right now and we don't we don't have to think about the cost of things nearly the way we did five or six years ago when
we were both working for other people at the same time.
Leland Gross (53:23.77)
Amazing. Well, Wes, thank you so much for being on. Tell the listeners where they can find you. If someone's interested in franchising or learning more, how can they get a hold of you and Path to Freedom?
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (53:39.582)
Yeah. So I'm very active on LinkedIn. Have started putting a lot more emphasis on YouTube. So I host a podcast as well. That's how Leland you and I connected you were a guest on the show. Not that long ago, which was a lot of fun. It's called the path to freedom podcast. It's on any of the you know, podcast platforms that are out there. We also post all of the full episodes with
video format on YouTube and have started putting a lot more time into YouTube doing other, you know, video content all designed to be educational in nature. A lot of it focused on franchising, but not exclusively to franchising. You know, I love talking to successful entrepreneurs and learning from them and sharing their stories. So YouTube, the podcast, LinkedIn, I have a website as well. But
in terms of like, what I hope is good valuable content, most of that will be on the podcast and, and YouTube and we'll make sure you have links to all of that to put in the show notes.
Leland Gross (54:48.506)
Yeah, we will make sure all of that is in the show notes for anybody who's interested, so go check them out. All right, Wes, thank you so much.
Wes Barefoot - Path To Freedom (54:56.118)
Thanks for having me. This was a lot of fun. Really appreciate the opportunity. And thanks for what you're doing, man. You're, you're providing a much needed service to small business owners and, and people that are self-employed. And, um, you know, so wish more people were approaching it the way that you are, um, selfishly for you. It's probably good that not as many people are, but, um, keep, keep up the great work, man. It's a, it's a much needed, uh, service.
Leland Gross (55:14.747)
Mmm.
Leland Gross (55:24.134)
I appreciate that.